On this episode of the People Fundamentals podcast, we’re joined by Paul Rubenstein, people analytics evangelist and chief customer officer at Visier, the people analytics platform that powers Betterworks’ Analytics and Insights.
Paul has a unique perspective on HR’s evolving role in business strategy, honed over years as a consultant at global giants like Mercer and Aon. He also served in the trenches as Visier’s head of HR, where he fell in love with using analytics to drive better people outcomes. Now, in his role as chief customer officer, Paul helps Visier’s clients unlock the potential of people analytics.
Tune in to hear Paul’s invaluable perspective on data’s role in revolutionizing HR — and business — outcomes, and learn how to implement new ideas to drive meaningful change.
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Empower change by democratizing data
Data can bridge the divide between goals set at the top — such as diversity targets — and the daily actions managers and employees take that affect organizational outcomes. Hiring managers, for example, must achieve both the immediate goal of finding the best candidate as well as the longer-term organizational goal of improving workforce diversity over time, Paul says.
Without data demonstrating trends and patterns in hiring, hiring managers can’t make informed hiring decisions that align with the company’s larger goals. “The only way to do it is to show everyone that data and to put it in everyone’s hands,” Paul says.
Democratizing data in this way collapses the distance between high-level diversity targets and actions taking place across the organization. “When they are actually given rational data to make an informed choice, they do rise to the occasion,” Paul says. “And if you can give them that data … persistently, that’s how you start to change behaviors.”
Enhance insights and automate actions through AI
Pushing data throughout the organization makes it possible to apply AI to augment how people interact with data and what they can learn from it. If someone leaves the organization, for example, AI can identify the characteristics that might have contributed to their decision and automatically alert managers and HR to other people who share those characteristics.
From there, it’s up to you to take action to apply what you’ve learned. “AI today is now able to show you that data and prompt … the next question,” Paul says. “Because the purpose of analytics is not to answer questions, it’s to get people to ask better questions.”
By leveraging AI in this way, organizations can gain efficiencies through automated notifications and ensure the right people are aware of risks or opportunities based on workforce trends.
“… the purpose of analytics is not to answer questions, it’s to get people to ask better questions.”
Paul Rubenstein, chief customer officer, visier
Simplify processes to unlock higher performance
In many organizations, Paul notes, there’s a clear need to simplify outdated HR processes like recruiting and performance management. By streamlining these systems and tools, companies can prioritize what truly matters — unlocking the potential of both managers and employees.
But data, once again, offers a solution to untangling these over-engineered processes. “People have woken up,” Paul says. “They realize that people data is business data, and that the corporate performance gap is the people gap.” Many of the answers to solving enterprise challenges can be found in the data we generate every day.
Taking a simpler and more intentional approach to performance management, for example, allows managers to proactively shape performance rather than just reporting on it. By providing intuitive tools and actionable insights to managers, companies can more effectively deploy the right people where they’re needed most, Paul says. This focus on end-users’ experiences is key to driving higher performance across organizations.
The ultimate goal of pushing data-driven insights across the organization is to help people at every level use that data to make decisions in real time — and that’s where HR can really drive value in an ever-changing workplace. “Let’s build processes and insights that help managers make better decisions,” Paul says. “I’m really proud to see that HR is waking up and falling in love with the problems rather than the solutions.”
People in This Episode
Paul Rubenstein: LinkedIn
Transcript
Paul Rubenstein:
AI today is now able to show you that data and prompt you the next question, because the purpose of analytics is not to answer questions, it’s to get people to ask better questions. It is an appreciative inquiry. Right? You don’t run for somebody to give you a chart. You see that chart and you ask the next, third, second, fourth, fifth question. And in the old days, you’d have to go back and forth between an analyst or a tool or a visualization or whatever it is, right? Now you just ask the AI and it collapses the speed to insight for a lot of people.
Alex Larralde:
Hi everyone, and welcome back to Betterworks Podcast People Fundamentals. I’m your host, Alex Larralde, Senior Director of Corporate Marketing. Betterworks core belief in people fundamentals revolves around helping HR lead through constant change by focusing on core values like fairness, support, balance, and enabling growth opportunities for employees.
These tenets empower everyone in the workforce to strive for excellence, to foster creativity, and to acknowledge each other’s contributions. Betterworks believes that strategic HR leaders can translate these principles into action, shaping their workforce for the better and helping drive meaningful business outcomes. And in this show, we’re diving even deeper into these principles as we hear from the experts about how you can make them come alive in your organization.
And in this episode, recorded live at HR Tech 2023 in Las Vegas we talked to Paul Rubenstein, Chief Human Resources Officer at Visier. With a background in consulting and a passion for leveraging technology to drive organizational change, Paul’s career journey and expertise give him the tools to show us what lies ahead. In our conversation, Paul shares invaluable insights into the world of HR, touching on topics ranging from the power of analytics to the transformative potential of AI.
We discuss real-world examples of how organizations use data-driven approaches to revolutionize their diversity efforts, streamline recruiting processes, and unlock the performance potential of their team. The role of HR is evolving and leaders like Paul are paving the way for a future where data-driven decision-making is the norm. From re-imagining traditional HR practices to embracing innovative solutions, Paul’s perspective offers a roadmap for organizations looking to thrive in today’s rapidly changing landscape.
So whether you’re a seasoned HR professional looking to stay ahead of the curve, or a business leader interested in harnessing the power of technology to drive organizational success, this conversation will leave you with a forward-thinking approach to implementing new ideas in your organization. I have the privilege and honor of sitting here with Paul Rubenstein, Chief Customer Officer Visier, former Chief Human Resources.
Paul Rubenstein:
Oh yeah, I’m on my third career at this point. I used to be a consultant. You know the ones that would go out and do those HR transformation projects?
Alex Larralde:
Oh yeah.
Paul Rubenstein:
Yeah. I was one of those, advising HR for many years.
Alex Larralde:
Awesome.
Paul Rubenstein:
I fell in love with a piece of technology because I’ve always dreamed of the day when we could unpack business strategy into a talent strategy that could be turned into numbers and then put those numbers across the entire organization so everybody made better people decisions. Anyway, I saw a company that had that, right? And so it’s a partner of Betterworks called Visier, and I loved the company so much I quit my job and joined. Became head of HR after a year there, and then now I’m Chief Customer Officer. So spreading the love and spreading the gospel of everybody making data-driven people decisions.
Alex Larralde:
Amazing. Yes, a valued partner of ours. We’re really excited about our advanced analytics product-
Paul Rubenstein:
Sweet.
Alex Larralde:
… and our customers are loving it too, so.
Paul Rubenstein:
Analytics is cool, right?
Alex Larralde:
It is. Absolutely. I actually started my career as an analyst. Fun fact.
Paul Rubenstein:
I love that.
Alex Larralde:
At a health insurance company.
Paul Rubenstein:
You know what? But this is the thing. This is what’s changed. A lot of analytics was just for special people or it was an elite skill or something, but everybody needs to make better people decisions. I mean, we use it every day. Think about it, Google Maps, that’s AI and analytics delivered to you in a way to make a decision right then and there. Why shouldn’t people have that same access to people data through good analytics? And so I’m glad to see what you guys are doing with analytics and help people see the patterns of what’s going on with their data. I love it.
Alex Larralde:
For sure. And actually, I’m curious, is there a particular customer story or a really cool example of how analytics made something possible for one of your customers that wasn’t possible before?
Paul Rubenstein:
Geez. I mean, there’s so many. I don’t know where to begin. I wasn’t prepared for that.
Alex Larralde:
Not to put you on the spot.
Paul Rubenstein:
Okay. I’m going to give you an easy one. Ready? I’m going to talk about something that’s really simple, diversity. Right? Because it’s something that impacts everyone, and it’s something that a lot of people have tried for years and years to change workforce composition.
I mean, I remember when I became head of HR at Visier, they were like, “Oh, we want to increase female representation,” and there’s this learned helplessness in tech about female representation. “Oh, it’s a boys club, engineering.” It’s like, “Nah, there’s, we can do better.” And I think the hardest thing for me in those years of consulting was watching people tackle a broad issue like diversity or turnover or engagement, you name it. And all of a sudden you realize as an executive, you’re kind of powerless. The actual result that you present to the board, right? And it’s always a graph. Up and to the right, you want it to go.
Alex Larralde:
Of course.
Paul Rubenstein:
The actual sum of those results. Right? Those results are the sum of lots of decisions made far from the C-suite. Lots of decisions that are distributed across the organizations. Right? Think about it, the choice around diversity happens at the front line between the manager and the employee.
Who’s going to get hired, who’s going to get fired, who’s going to get promoted, who’s going to get nominated for a leadership program, et cetera. And if you think about that manager, they got a lot of stuff on their mind, man. It’s a noisy world on there. So how do you collapse the distance between a collective outcome, a corporate goal like diversity, and the everyday decision of one of 29 decisions? Right? Because man, you’re trying to hire. Imagine working in a call center.
You just want to get that body in there as fast as possible. Your goal is someone you know that’s going to perform. Are you hitting the dual goal of filling the job with the right person and meeting the collective goal of changing their workforce composition? Not always, unless you’re reminded. So by taking that data, right? And some people are embarrassed by their data, “Oh my god, if we show that our diversity data is bad, we’re going to get criticized.”
The only way to do it is to show everyone that data and to put it in everyone’s hands. Right? So we were able to go up what? We went from 26 to 37 percent representation, and we’re continuing to work at it in just three years. Right? That’s a meaningful composition. But by showing people the analytics of who’s your next choice, who left, who came, why, what’s revealed in those patterns. Right? And people when they are actually given rational data to make an informed choice, they do rise to the occasion.
And if you can give them that data easily, simple graphs and charts, simple… and not have them beg to go get it and put it in their hand persistently, that’s how you start to change behaviors. It’s the same way you respond to those Instagram ads for that secret candy you’ve been wanting to subscribe to, that candy service. They send it to you over and over again, and eventually, it gets in your brain. But this is using those powers for good.
Alex Larralde:
Absolutely.
Paul Rubenstein:
Was that a long enough answer for you?
Alex Larralde:
I love it. It’s a great example.
Paul Rubenstein:
I don’t even think I breathe during the entire time.
Alex Larralde:
I mean, it’s a perfect example of why it’s so important that we democratize data, make it available to people. I think it’s great. I want to ask you about AI. It’s what everybody’s talking about. Everybody’s got some AI. Everybody’s curious about how it’s being used in all of these different technologies.
Paul Rubenstein:
Are we talking about the evil secret science fiction AI or the real AI?
Alex Larralde:
Both really.
Paul Rubenstein:
Okay.
Alex Larralde:
It’s the perception and then the reality. So what is your take on AI in HR? Are people ready for it? Do you think that-
Paul Rubenstein:
So it’s already there, right?
Alex Larralde:
Right.
Paul Rubenstein:
This is the thing. It’s just becoming, people have woken up to see what the real good use cases are, right? So I’ll give you two. Somebody leaves the organization. Imagine the AI says, “Oh, look, this person has these characteristics and there are 10 other people who fall into those characteristics. Let’s alert those managers so that they can be aware and take a look.”
The same way marketing uses intelligence about who crawls through a website et cetera to alert a salesperson around propensity to buy, you can do that same technology and those same patterns using AI to alert and trigger and automate. Right? What goes through. Right? So that’s one easy one. Right? The next one is more how people interact with data. Right? What do people love about their experiments with ChatGPT? You ask it a plain language question. Okay? Did you ever go to a data scientist and try to ask for an analytics question and get a plain language answer?
Alex Larralde:
Right.
Paul Rubenstein:
No. You get charts and graphs and all kinds of stuff. What AI does for the way we interact with analytics, right? Which are patterns of data, not confined to a single data set and contextualized in the real time of the person who’s trying to ask, it becomes more of a, “Oh, I understood your question. Let me give you a simple answer and let me show you what the next question to ask is. Who are my top salespeople? These are them.” You should ask, “Which of those are likely to leave?
Who is up for promotion this year? Which ones have deals closing in the fourth quarter that you might want to go give some love to?” Right? But again, the AI today is now able to show you that data and prompt you the next question, because the purpose of analytics is not to answer questions, it’s to get people to ask better questions. It is an appreciative inquiry, right?
Alex Larralde:
Right. I love that point of view.
Paul Rubenstein:
Yeah. And that’s how you have to think about it. You don’t run for somebody to give you a chart. You see that chart and you ask the next, third, second, fourth, fifth question. And in the old days, you’d have to go back and forth between an analyst or a tool or a visualization or whatever it is, right? Now you just ask the AI and it collapses the speed to insight for a lot of people.
Alex Larralde:
It’s major, and I think it’s going to be transformative for sure.
Paul Rubenstein:
Again, your listeners are going, “God, that guy gives long answers.” I am so sorry.
Alex Larralde:
Well, I have really enjoyed talking to you, Paul. I appreciate it. I appreciate-
Paul Rubenstein:
We have time for one more.
Alex Larralde:
… you stopping by. Yeah. Okay. I love being able to see what everybody’s doing as a marketer. Seeing how people position their products and how they talk about them right now is really interesting, especially in this kind of generative AI world. So I’ve seen responsible AI, I’ve seen human AI, and I am excited to see where all of this goes.
Paul Rubenstein:
What’s interesting to me is, yeah, there’s a lot of talk about AI, but there’s still such tremendous amount of energy around some of the basics. Right? And two areas that I see a lot of interest in basics. One of them surprises me, one of them doesn’t.
The surprise one for me is the entire recruiting tech stack. Once again, people are sitting there going, “I’m not happy with my recruiting process. I have too many technologies.” And the complexity of it, I’m like, “Wow, they’re still rethinking it.” Nobody is championing their ATS. Nobody is super happy. And then the other part that of course is of always interest is performance, right? Which I know is near and dear to your heart.
Alex Larralde:
Absolutely.
Paul Rubenstein:
Right? And I think people have woken up. They realize that people data is business data and that the corporate performance gap is the people gap. And if you can unlock the performance of an individual, of a team, et cetera, in a labor constrained market, you’ve got gold. It’s hard, just like it’s hard to acquire a new customer, it’s hard and expensive to acquire a new employee.
Alex Larralde:
It really is.
Paul Rubenstein:
Let’s get the most out of them. Let’s understand where to place our assets correctly. Let’s get a true vision of performance and help managers not just report on performance, but shape performance and let’s help individuals shape performance. And so there’s a lot of energy going around that. So kudos to you and your team because you are making that world a better place.
Alex Larralde:
Yeah, thank you. I’m really excited about our new capabilities to help managers be more effective and efficient. As a manager and somebody who-
Speaker 3:
Oh, yeah. I mean we were [inaudible 00:13:00]
Alex Larralde:
… also rolls up my sleeves to get the work done, it can be a lot. The workload can be a lot. And I think that we are on the cusp of streamlining a lot of painful things for people that we’ve just suffered through needlessly.
Paul Rubenstein:
You just hit it, streamlining. And I think that’s an important part of what you and a lot of other vendors, and you’ll see around here, right? A lot of people are waking up and realizing it’s not about HR, it’s about the customer of HR. And let’s not build processes that make it easy for HR. Let’s build processes and insights that help managers make better decisions. I’m really proud to see that HR is waking up and falling in love with the problems rather than the solutions, as [inaudible 00:13:43] would say. So kudos.
Alex Larralde:
Thank you. Well, thanks so much, Paul. It’s been great talking.
Paul Rubenstein:
Awesome. Great being here.
Alex Larralde:
In this conversation, we explored the power of analytics and AI and driving organizational change with real world examples illustrating how data-driven approaches are revolutionizing the HR landscape. Here are three key takeaways that you can implement in your own organization. First, embrace data-driven decision-making. Leverage analytics to gain insights into workforce composition, identify patterns, and inform better people decisions.
By making data accessible to everyone, you empower your teams to make informed choices that drive positive outcomes. Second, streamline HR processes. Take a critical look at your recruiting tech stack and performance management systems. Simplify processes and focus on solutions that prioritize both managers and employees by providing intuitive tools and insights that support better decision-making. Lastly, foster a culture of innovation.
Encourage a mindset of continuous improvement and experimentation within your organization. Embrace new technologies and approaches that challenge the status quo and drive positive change. By fostering a culture of innovation, you position your organization for long-term success in an ever-evolving landscape.
If you’re a leader looking to drive organizational change, these principles will set you up for success in today’s dynamic world. Be sure to stay tuned for our next episode of the People Fundamentals Podcast. Subscribe to us on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or YouTube music. And if you like what you hear, share us with your friends and colleagues. We’ll see you again soon.
